Barbados Police Force Getting A Bum Rap

Submitted by RUSERIOUS

An article was posted on that ignorant site called BFP about the and I quote “Inability of the Police Force to stem the violence“. I respond as a law abiding citizen who has a clue.

You say “inability of the Police force to stem the violence?” You are being sarcastic right? Let’s check some facts. There are 80,000 persons since Barbados became independent who have been charged with a crime. That is a significant portion of the population.

Time after time and all the time and every time the judiciary hands down monkey sentences, and recycles criminals through the prison system, violent repeat offenders who no longer serve a purpose in society are sentenced to miniscule prison sentences, come out, kill/rob/rape again multiple times,  are caught by police and the process repeats itself. Nearly ALL of the persons committing violent crime have multiple conviction records on average of 7 or more convictions. Some have as much as thirty for burglary/robbery/serious bodily harm/possession of weapons.

Now you tell me that the POLICE can’t stop violent crime?? It’s a half statement. THE POLICE cannot stop violent  crime when the judiciary constantly does not enforce maximum penalties for crimes. One example is the man who killed the Canadian got 10 years and on appeal it was raised to 15. The man who killed Bibi Ifill got 15 years. He killed her and stuffed her in a well and claimed he knew nothing of it. Got 15 years…When was the last time someone was sentenced to life in prison for killing someone else? Probably in the 70s or 80s those two clowns who blow up an old lady in her home with dynamite and now want to get out.

There are burglars who are charged and plead guilty to multiple counts of burglaries, robbers who plead guilty to multiple counts of robberies and are sentenced to three years CONCURRENT on each charge, meaning society is only protected from them for three years. You claim in your article that the COP is mad at BFP for scrutinizing the police and that issues that once died quickly are now kept in the public eye forever by BFP.  Well you are still useless because you keep mis-information and mis-issues in the public eye.

Instead of focusing on the real cause, you are at the police. Then when the police play judge jury and executioner there is a problem. But the reality is we have a NON functioning judiciary. How is it that someone who breaks into a house 20 times can spend three years in prison, come back out, repeat the cycle, get caught again, break 20 more houses, get caught again, do it again in three years?

What about the Customs Officers and guards at our ports of entry who are taking bribes to let in unknown packages containing guns? Are the police to blame for that too? Blaming the police for crime is like blaming the sanitation for garbage, Police don’t generate the garbage they only clean it up. Similarly the Police don’t make the violent crime, they do their best to clean it up, and then the landfill (judiciary) puts the garbage back on the street again for the sanitation/police to go and deal with it again.

If you want results, put pressure on parliament to change laws giving the judiciary mandatory orders to pass sentences that will jail violent repeat offenders for life. Laws that will help police locate, identify and prosecute the organizers of crime  such as the gang leaders who hands are not dirty and who can never be prosecuted with the absence of conspiracy charges.

How many Immigration officers selling Barbados passports and work permit stamps do you see prosecuted? At least the Police Force gets rid of the ones among them giving trouble, when was the last time you saw Immigration get rid of one of their own, all the corruption in customs, when did Customs get rid of their own? When Immigration and Customs wrong you, who do you complain to? They do not have a complaints department at all, at least the Police have one.

Police officers who are found doing unlawful acts are charged and tried before the court, if they get off in the court it is a matter again for the judiciary. You need to wake up and hop off your high horse about the police, because otherwise nothing will change if you keep beating the wrong child with the stick.

March and get together, use your blackberry, use Facebook, use Twitter, march on your politicians, demand they change the laws to keep violent repeat offenders behind bars. Call them, write them, email them, put stickers about it all over the country, call the radio call in program, demand the judiciary sentence people accordingly.

Crime is not only now out of hand, it has been out of hand for some years now as the gold prices have risen and street robberies rise as a result. But now that people are dying and people are afraid, now you want the police to do something, well news flash all the people that are robbing you, have done it before. Now people are getting shot and dying, everyone wants the police to do something about it. The parents who raise vagabond children want the police to do something about it.

So I ask you… R U SERIOUS??

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60 Comments on “Barbados Police Force Getting A Bum Rap”

  1. The Scout August 13, 2011 at 2:12 PM #

    Certainly the police force cannot stop crime when the judicial is weak. There are persons who the police officers have to hunt down to be from before the court to answer a charge, only to see the magistrate give the person bail. Many times the officers are out search for these same persons again for another crime committed. There are PSV drivers who have over a hundred cases in court, also there are other persons who have more than one case in court and sometimes unpaid fines for over one year;can this be the police force’s fault. We have been promised a C.J for a while now and the system is getting worse everyday and the drug persons are taking advantage of it.,

    Like

  2. David August 13, 2011 at 2:35 PM #

    It is absolutely embarrassing that this government has not been able to appoint a Chief Justice even has there is rising fear of crime in the society.

    To those who ask if the appointment will stop crime then God help us.

    Like

  3. jack spratt August 13, 2011 at 3:41 PM #

    What do you mean by your last sentence, David? I do not understand. Are you saying that if the new CJ cannot stop crime, then only God can?

    Like

  4. David August 13, 2011 at 3:47 PM #

    @spratt

    Some have asked the question elsewhere if by appointing a CJ how will that stop crime.

    Like

  5. HAMILTON HILL August 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM #

    The late Mr.Thornhill (may he rest in peace) was killed by a driver who had better than ONE HUNDRED convictions ,yet still held the privilege of a driver’s license. R U Serious is right on point. Ours is a society where the connected ones fly high, yet beneath the radar of public scrutiny. Imagine the fustration of an officer who would have busted his ass, risked life and limb to do his job then to see it all gone for naught,all because of a DISFUNCTIONAL SYSTEM.

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  6. David August 13, 2011 at 4:01 PM #

    When we critique the judiciary let us not forget the Court Registry famous for misfiling or losing court files at the most inopportune time i.e a case due to be heard of a prominent or connected person.

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  7. jack spratt August 13, 2011 at 4:01 PM #

    Ok, David, I see.

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  8. David August 13, 2011 at 4:05 PM #

    BTW there was another* fatal shooting in Haynesville today. Can anyone update us on where we are on the number of fatal shootings for 2011 and year over year comparison?

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  9. The Scout August 13, 2011 at 6:02 PM #

    I keep saying that unless politicians and judicial administrators stop hiding their heads in the sand, we will quickly become like Jamaica, Guyana, T&T, and St Lucia, time to call a spade a spade and stop pussyfooting around

    Like

  10. Sean August 13, 2011 at 8:19 PM #

    A friend pointed me to this website and post…I have to say the thing is, if I had to guess, I would say probably five hundred people in Barbados are fully informed of what really goes on, why violent crime persists.

    All you need to do is read the court section of the paper every day and ever so often you see the instances where a guy pleads guilty to multiple burglary/robbery and is sentenced to three years concurrent on each count- just to see what the OP is referring too.

    Why should detectives in the police force live at police stations neglecting family, their life, all for God and Country when they are paid shit, treated like shit, blamed for shit that has nothing to do with them and isn’t their fault, and then the judiciary just let’s people go and no one cares, except when a big up is killed/robbed/burgled.

    Last person to be hanged in Barbados was it not the guy convicted of killing Tom Adam’s grandmother? I bet the guy who was hanged never committed anymore crime.

    You got people in Barbados who may be in prison now who have killed at least two people. And eventually they will be back out to go for a third.

    The Police are to blame alright, they are to blame for remaining silent, when they know the truth about why criminals and violent ones are so prevalent in our society and free to do as they please, but to speak the truth means that the public will know that the Judiciary, The Judges, the parliamentarians are to blame for the state of affairs in Barbados. And no Administration in the Force would last long if they did that.

    Years ago when guns became the focus for the judiciary they passed the firearm amendment legislation, 25 years maximum for any person found guilty of possessing a firearm. What happened? The gun toters were scared when the law passed, but as time passed and a few of them got caught and they were able to see the monkey sentences still being handed down, similar to any other crime, they were no longer deterred, it’s alright to have it on paper, but to actually set the precedent, you have to enforce it in the court.

    Until offenses such as robbery are amended to carry a mandatory 10 years in prison, until consecutive sentences are done, then nothing will deter violent criminals.

    And it’s not our present Attorney General’s fault, he only just came to office…he might be the one to have to fix it, if he stays in power, because if the DEMS lose the election, then we are at square one again with another BLP Attorney General, and possibly one like Dale Marshall who is a complete idiot, and regardless the BLP had power for fourteen years so they are largely responsible for a lot of these problems.

    What happens when the remaining best and brightest and most dedicated Police decide to say screw it? And be informed a good portion of our best and brightest are senior police, they are getting old, they are not going to be running after 16 year olds with guns when they are in their late 40’s and late 50’s.

    Then you will have chaos.

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    -Sean Harris

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  11. The Scout August 13, 2011 at 8:29 PM #

    I was told of a notorious murderer who is in jail, bodyslam a prison officer one day and said ” I kill one man already and dey gun kill me, but dey can kill me twice.” Yet many taxpayers’ money is keeping him to be a menace to the prison. Eat, drink and be merry because the system say they can’t hang you.

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  12. Bush Tea August 13, 2011 at 8:31 PM #

    @ RUSERIOUS
    LOL
    Wait! you actually read that other blog?
    R U Serious?

    What do you want to bet that each magistrate and judge either have a police bodyguard or a personal firearm….

    Don’t you think that it is a mistake to provide them with such insulation from actual reality? Maybe if they were as exposed as the rest of us they would take their jobs much more serious.

    Have you ever been involved in a case prosecuted by the police? Sometimes one cannot blame the judge for being fed up with the mediocrity and shabbiness.
    The WHOLE thing is unprofessional, mediocre and inefficient… it reflects the current police leadership from the AG and the COP and the LACK of leadership of the judiciary.

    The RBPF obviously cannot control the crime situation on their own, however they can certainly provide clear and decisive national LEADERSHIP in this venture …. if only they had real leaders.

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  13. Zoe August 13, 2011 at 9:01 PM #

    Did you hear of a prominent QC Laywer, whose name I’ll not mention, that recently had a burgular enter his livingroom, demanding money at Gun point?

    Well the QC said, my money was left in my car, here are the car keys, go take the money and car, please don’t kill me! The thief did jus that, drove away the car, where it was found abandoned last that week.

    The QC had wrought iron installed at his front door within days. Would you believe that the SAME burgular came back within one week, pointing the gun at the neck of the QC’s wife, demanding more money! They had to unlock the wrought iron, in walks Mr. Criminal, the QC goes to his bedroom to get the cash, the phone rings, AND the criminal answers the phone, and starts speaking in Spanish, he was expecting the call, obviously!

    The police were called in again, given the story, and said, “….we know who that man is…” the QC, apparently said to them, “…well aren’t you going to get him…” The police gave no response to that question from the QC!

    Apparently, a lot more crime is happening in B’dos, than is been reported in the media!

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  14. Sayed August 13, 2011 at 9:36 PM #

    Why not mention his name? It was in the Barbadostoday online paper, it was Barry Gale.

    @Bush Tea, what does shabby evidence, or otherwise have to do with sentencing, upon someone being convicted? The two don’t relate. The OP didn’t say anything about acquittals, he spoke to persons pleading guilty to multiple robberies and burglaries and receiving “monkey” sentences such as 3 years concurrent.

    That has nothing to do with police giving evidence, because the police do not give evidence of the person pleads guilty, so your point smacks of nonsensical thinking.

    What of the persons who are convicted and receive the light sentences? That was the point being made.

    And if criminal lawyers want to fool themselves they can, they are just as nasty, they take the blood/drug money and represent them even though they know they are guilty.

    Unless lawyers actually believe that there are in fact no guns, no drugs and no crime ever committed and it is all made up.

    They’ll probably say the Police Officers shot themselves five times next…

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  15. Bush Tea August 13, 2011 at 9:39 PM #

    @ Zoe

    Man Zoe, the bushman missed your contributions recently…you on holiday or what?

    National progress requires real leadership:
    Leadership requires real MEN.

    Can you explain Isaiah 3 – in relation to what happens when a people turn their backs on their God?
    Verses 9 and 12 seem particularly relevant to a lowly bushman….. perhaps it will become clearer why the police /judiciary/ government / schools / prison are all helpless to address this problem.

    ..oppressed by teenage hooligans and ruled by an increasing number of estrogen fueled, emotion driven, women and / or effeminates. (sounds like our Judiciary?).

    “the look on their faces witnesses against them
    and they declare their sin as Sodom
    THEY DO NOT HIDE IT.’
    Woe to their soul…..

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  16. Bush Tea August 13, 2011 at 9:51 PM #

    @ Sayed
    Keep your turban on sir. Who said anything about sentencing or pleading guilty? the Bushman was simply speaking to professionalism and effectiveness.
    Pleading guilty is one thing, but putting forward and proving the CORRECT charge is also relevant.
    Evidence also needs to be led to SUPPORT strong sentencing by the court.
    If you allow a criminal to enter a lesser plea (out of laziness and to get the thing over with), what would you expect the judge to do? impose maximum sentence based on facebook rumors?

    Your substantive point is sound, but our police force also has major challenges to be addressed. It is not perfect….or even very efficient.

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  17. ROBERT August 13, 2011 at 10:05 PM #

    ITS STRANGE HOW THE WRITER CAN BE BLAMING THE JUDGES FOR THIS SITUATION THESE ARE THE SAME OFFICERS WHO WILL GO AND DISCUSS A CACE WITH THE SAME JUDGES SO THAT THE RESULTS WILL GO IN THEIR FAVOUR . HOW MANY TIMES THE POLICE CHARGE PERSONS WITH OUT READING THEM THEIR RIGHTS , DO YOU REMEMBER THE ST LUCY CASE WHERE THE POLICE SAID D MAN JUMP AND ANOTHER OFFICER SAID SOME THING ELSE WHAT WAS THE VERDICT IN THAT CASE , THE POLICE LIED YET THEY WON THE VERDICT , HOW ABOUT THE (SAND FLY –SMALL)KILLING AT MTW YEASR AGO WHAT WAS THE VERDICT —-BUT WE HAVE AN INTERESTING ONE COME UP –SEAWIEW MAN CHARGE WITH POLICE DEATH —ONE POLICE SAID IT WAS FRIENDLY FIRE — THE VERDICT O NO . WELL LOOK AND SEE THE POLICE WORKING AT SUPERMARKETS (MOONLIGHTINING )WHEN THEIR ARREST SOME ONE THEY SAY THAT HE D POLICE WAS SHOPPING , DO THEY PAY TAXES ON THE EXTRA JOD –IS NOT THAT A CRIME—- AND YET THE THEY BLAME ALL EXCEPT THEMSELVE—–YES THEY R SOME HONEST POLICE BUT ONE IN EVERY 500 HUNDRED . WE HAVE POLICE WHO HAVE THESE YOUNG BOYS SELLING DRUGS FOR THE POLICE AND POLICE STEALING POLICE GUNS AND SELLING ,

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  18. John August 13, 2011 at 10:45 PM #

    Have you ever been involved in a case prosecuted by the police? Sometimes one cannot blame the judge for being fed up with the mediocrity and shabbiness.
    The WHOLE thing is unprofessional, mediocre and inefficient… it reflects the current police leadership from the AG and the COP and the LACK of leadership of the judiciary.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    The Thusday Advocate of 14th April 2011 reported that ” After calling 11 witnesses in the Cattlewash Beach House Aggravated Burgalry the case was brought to an abrupt end because of Police discrepancies”

    “The Irvings told the court that two men had entered their beach house them at gunpoint before robbing them and escaping in a white car.”

    “Irvings wife, Sandra, said she thought her family was going to be killed. She added that one of the robbers made her and her daughter lie on the ground while holding a gun on them.”

    “Their friend, Marcia Stabler, also told how she was terrified while kneeling wit a gun pointed at her, and all she could do was say her prayers during the four minute ordeal”.

    “Arthur Irving who was 77 at the time, had been coming to Barbados since 1964″

    “The Crowns case was presented by Deputy Director of Public Prosecutions, Donna Babb-Agard QC and acting senior crown counsel, Elwood Watts.”

    “The men who represented themselves cross examined the witnesses”.

    Like

  19. de hood August 13, 2011 at 11:02 PM #

    @ Robert

    You seem to have a lot of evidence pertaining to illegal activities by police officers. Well since that is so then why the hell don’t you submit this information to the relevant authorities and let them act on it?

    I guess you won’t because you CAN”T! Simply because you just talking CRAP! Put up or SHUT up!

    Like

  20. David August 13, 2011 at 11:07 PM #

    A growing problem the police will have to confront is growing public distrust. This is a serious problem which will act as an obstacle for the citizenry reporting confidential info to the police. The police should give more prominence in their communication to Crime Stoppers which promotes anonymity because on a 2×3 island like Barbados 2 or 3 bad cops will block the confidence needed for the public to engender full confidence.

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  21. Sayed August 14, 2011 at 12:34 AM #

    Wow Robert, how can discussing a “cace” with the Judge make it go in their favour? Since in Barbados juries decide the accused fate not Judges.

    [QUOTE]Pleading guilty is one thing, but putting forward and proving the CORRECT charge is also relevant.
    Evidence also needs to be led to SUPPORT strong sentencing by the court.
    If you allow a criminal to enter a lesser plea (out of laziness and to get the thing over with), what would you expect the judge to do? impose maximum sentence based on facebook rumors?[/quote]

    You again are not understanding. Evidence has nothing to do with a man saying I AM GUILTY to 20 burglaries and being sentenced to three years in prison. Where does evidence come in that scenario? The man is not even challenging his guilt.

    Again pleading guilty to robbery/burglary is not pleading guilty to a lesser offence because that is the original charge…you sir are not comprehending what was written.

    Also if the ‘criminal’ as you say enters a lesser plea out of ‘laziness’ to ‘get the thing over with’. I would expect the Judge to sentence him based on the fact that he pleaded guilty and he will base his sentence on the facts. Where does facebook rumours come into it?

    The only charge which you could be referring to about lesser pleas is murder/manslaughter. There is no other charge which persons are charged with and then plead guilty to the lesser count usually other than murder. Again what do I expect the Judge to do if some person pleads guilty to the lesser charge of manslaughter rather than murder? He is saying yes I killed him but I did not murder him? Well impose the maximum sentence based on the facts of the case, he UNLAWFULLY killed another person. The maximum sentence for manslaughter is life in prison.

    Evidence has nothing to do with sentencing, evidence has to do with determining the guilt of the accused, once he has been proven guilty or pleads guilty, evidence does not matter. The gravity of the offence matters.

    Like

  22. islandgal246 August 14, 2011 at 2:38 AM #

    A few years ago a friend of mine called the police after she was burgled. They came with a note book, she asked if that was all they came with. The told her yes. She asked them what happened that they are not checking for fingerprints? They told her that they were just taking her statement. She kindly asked them to leave her premises.

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  23. Bush Tea August 14, 2011 at 7:18 AM #

    @ Sayed

    Bushie’s error…. was acting under the impression that you were intelligent.
    Bushman out!

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  24. Sayed August 14, 2011 at 8:53 AM #

    @bush

    You would first have had to have been an intelligent person to be able to gauge the intelligence of another person such as myself.

    You just have no clue about crime/courts/law/order I am a Bridgetown court clerk, I see it all.

    It is people like you who are indifferent to the plight of others because you do not live it.

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  25. David August 14, 2011 at 9:02 AM #

    We can bicker all we want, what is evident is that despite the reassurances from the COP there is now a rising fear in Barbados as a result of rising crime in Barbados.

    It is time for Barbados to layout an action plan how we will take back our communities from the scum which have started to terrorize.

    The institutions like the police, judiciary, BAR association etc directly involved need to step up and partner with wider society to wipe this crap from our landscape.

    Like

  26. HAMILTON HILL August 14, 2011 at 9:38 AM #

    @ Sean….. I believe that Mopsy met the hangman’s noose since the guy that killed Tom’s Grandmother….@ Sayed…… Criminal Lawyers are just as nasty…….What then is your proposal in terms of representation? No Lawyer? As a Court-Clerk surely you know of the backlog that already stunts the system. The appellate division would be flooded.

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  27. Zoe August 14, 2011 at 9:50 AM #

    BT, Your question is extremely relevant in today’s SIN SICK world, and in particular, Barbados, as we did ouselves deeper and deeper into the moras of immorality, and every other shade of depravity.

    “Can you expain Isaiah 3 – in relation to what happens when a people turn their backs on their God?”

    BT, the Prophet Isaiah, speaks as POWERFULLY to our DAY* as he did to the society of his day, about (700-690 B.C) He focused a spotlight of HOLINESS* upon the SORDID* SINS* of Israel; this WE also need in B’dos today; as he summoned his contemporaries to CEASE from their social injustice, their quest for CARNAL indulgence, their trust in the arm of flesh, and their hypocritical PRETENSE of orthodox religion. He also warned of the consequences of God’s judgment IF sin continued.

    Yes, verses 9 and 12 are also very applicable to our society.

    “The look on their countenance witnesses against them ( How very true in B’dos!) And they declare their SIN as Sodom ( As seen at the Drag Queen show!) They do not hide it, Woe to their soul! For they have brought EVIL upon themselves.” (v.9 Emphasis added).

    Rhianna has been lauded by our authorities, who spent $4 MILLION to bring her here, to promote our tourism industry. Bajans, et al, whose consciences are NUMB, cannot see beyond the pretty face, that her music, IS* for the most part instigated and energized by Satan, with DEEP occultic connotations, and Mia Mottley stupidly said while interviewed by CBC after the show, I paraphase, “…May God continue to bless and protect Rhianna…” what UTTER, spiritual blindedness and folly coming from Mottley! Almighty God CANNOT and does NOT bless such abased SIN!

    “As for My people, children are their oppressors. And women rule over them. O My people! Those who lead you cause you to err. And destroy the way of your paths.” (v.12)

    Yes, again, so very applicable to our society, in so many ways. Many of our children, young men/women, are in serious trouble, drugs, terrible sexual depravity, etc, etc; AND, also, many our our Women, DO rule over us, in part because any number of us men, have abdicated our roles in the home, and in wider societal roles as well.

    But, BT, this downward trend in evey aspect and area of our socities, worldwide, IS* specifically spoken to and about, in God’s Word, the Bible, and IS* literally unfolding daily before our eyes and lives, as HE* said it would.

    The Only asnwer, for the individual, family unit, parish, and Nation, IS to Repent of ours SINS* and by faith, reasonal faith, TURN our hearts back to the Lord Jesus Christ, as we ALL worldwide, are going to witness, experience, and FEEL, distress beyond words, and, I feel this is going to become a living reality, come 2012 and beyond, all of the signs are there, just around the corner!

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  28. Sayed August 14, 2011 at 10:48 AM #

    Solution to nasty criminal lawyers? How about disbar them? Didn’t say the accused shouldn’t have defense.

    Since the Police are the problem then I suggest disbanding the Police force, it’s only the unarmed lower/middle class being affected anyway, who cares about them.

    I know for certain that the study of the decline of our society one hundred years from now will be an intriguing topic for historians.

    Like

  29. David August 14, 2011 at 11:22 AM #

    In a related story check out what is happening in Guyana:

    By Dale Andrews

    Damning evidence of links between senior police officers and elements in the local illegal drug circuit surfaced last week during a high level administrative meeting of the Force.
    Allegations of the close association of a Senior Superintendent and an Assistant Superintendent of Police with members of drug cartels were leveled by an Assistant Commissioner, leading to the temporary resignation of one of the officers involved.

    http://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2011/08/14/fiery-administrative-meeting-links-senior-cops-to-drug-dealers/

    Like

  30. David August 14, 2011 at 12:33 PM #

    A 28 year old man (Adrian Williams) shot in the wee hours of this morning. It is the fourth murder for the month which is at mid-point.

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  31. islandgal246 August 14, 2011 at 12:51 PM #

    And it was in front of Chefette Speightstown. It seems that some bajans are on a killing spree! Guns are everywhere I wonder how they are being acquired? Who is bring them in and how are they bypassing customs?

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  32. David August 14, 2011 at 1:02 PM #

    Drugs and guns go hand in hand.

    There is the oft-cliche which seems relevant in the circumstance: follow the money. Why is it we have not been able to take out any of the drug kingpins? There was a lot of ceremony when Barbados set up the money laundering unit which works with the banks to identify large and suspicious transactions. Is this another initiative where we see an army of occupation?

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  33. Bush Tea August 14, 2011 at 1:03 PM #

    @ Zoe
    Thank you very much. Explained as only you can. Of course few will pay any attention to your ‘spot-on’ diagnosis, but that is neither here nor there….. it is much more fun to argue over the symptoms.

    LOL, This does not however, affect our ongoing standoff with respect to specific issues between us…..

    @ Sayed
    “I am a Bridgetown Law Clerk”
    ************************************
    Bush Tea’s case rest your honor

    Take it easy Sayed. BT lays no claim to high intelligence, (else he would be a clerical officer at UWI). The bushman was just hoping to extract some meaningful data from our exchange… clearly this is like squeezing water from a stone.

    For the record:….re read…
    1 -Bushie did NOT say that criminals enter a lesser plea because they want to get it over with…. BUT THAT THE POLICE accept a lesser plea to avoid the effort of proving the more serious charge.
    2 – If a judge has the discretion to impose a penalty ranging from 10 years to probation on conviction, do you not think that his /her final decision will be highly influenced by the case presented by the prosecution?

    No response needed.

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  34. Hants August 14, 2011 at 2:30 PM #

    David wrote “there is now a rising fear in Barbados as a result of rising crime in Barbados.”

    This fear has been building over the last 5 to 10 years.

    This crime wave will destroy the major industries in Barbados if it is not stopped in its tracks.

    Tourism and financial services are the most vulnerable.

    Time to put deploy the Defence force around the island to stop the drug laden boats from landing.

    More drug sniffing dogs at the Airport.

    More Police raids on known drug dealers. They will also find the Guns.

    Like

  35. Sayed August 14, 2011 at 2:32 PM #

    @BT [quote] For the record:….re read…
    1 -Bushie did NOT say that criminals enter a lesser plea because they want to get it over with…. BUT THAT THE POLICE accept a lesser plea to avoid the effort of proving the more serious charge. [/quote]

    1- And your HATRED of the POLICE has BLINDED you. Here again I will point out the ERRORS in your post.

    Since when do the POLICE prosecute cases where lesser pleas can be entered? Since only PLEAS to LESSER CHARGES are entered in High Court, the Attorney General’s Office and the Public Prosecution Service prosecutes high court cases. So I ask you how can the POLICE accept a lower plea?? Yet you have capitalized it again in your post. Reinforcing an erroneous statement that you made earlier.

    You have shown in each post that you have NO CLUE. Each statement you make reveals this.

    2- [quote]If a judge has the discretion to impose a penalty ranging from 10 years to probation on conviction, do you not think that his /her final decision will be highly influenced by the case presented by the prosecution?[/quote]

    Again you miss the point. The prosecution does not have to present a case where someone stands and says YES I DID IT. I KILLED THEM. No trial needed. The Judge does not have anything to consider other than the actions that the accused pleaded GUILTY to doing.

    I stand by my statement, the ordinary average bajan has not got a clue what really goes on.

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  36. Observing August 14, 2011 at 3:27 PM #

    Corruption, greed, materialism, zero accountability and little to no (political, family, community or judicial) leadership bring “gifts” and easy money for a few. Easy money for a few and disillusionment bring a (greater) separation of classes. A greater separation of classes brings severe sub-cultures. Severe sub-cultures bring drugs and crime (along with many other blatantly undesirable characteristics and behaviours). Drugs bring guns. Guns bring excessive violence. Excessive violence brings fear. Fear brings prejudice. Prejudice brings pride and partisanship. Pride and partisanship bring the end of great societies as we know them.

    The magic question is, who’s willing to step forward and stem the tide????

    Like

  37. David August 14, 2011 at 3:32 PM #

    @Observing

    The fact that we are having this conversation in Barbados today is both a revelation and indictment.

    Like

  38. Bush Tea August 14, 2011 at 3:34 PM #

    OK Sayed

    So tell us how come different convicted persons receive different sentences for very similar crimes.

    If the bushman were to bushwhack you tomorrow and take away your court files -who decides if bushie will be charged with aggravated robbery, common assault, playing the fool,….or not charged at all?

    How will the judge decide if to throw the book at bushie or throw a kiss? Are you saying that this does not depend on the charge brought and the details presented to the court?

    …and Sayed – no need to get all emotional, Bushie actually is highly PRO-Police. especially Bajan cops. But facts are facts, and we need to face reality if we are to fix problems.

    Like

  39. Hants August 14, 2011 at 3:44 PM #

    We are having this conversation because the problem is a very serious one and the public is realising that the thugs and vagabonds are becoming bolder.

    Like

  40. Bush Tea August 14, 2011 at 3:45 PM #

    @ Observing
    The magic question is, who’s willing to step forward and stem the tide????
    **************************************
    …and do exactly WHAT Observing?

    Your analysis is relevant all over the world – in most places more so than even in Barbados.
    THE ONLY SOLUTION is the one that has been referred to earlier in this thread by Zoe, but this is ridiculed by even the most learned and knowledgeable posters here on BU….

    Everything else has been tried, yet we are hearing educated persons calling for another change in leadership as a solution; or a change in tax policy; or a change in police tactics etc….

    The truth is that if you have smoked or imbibed all your life and enjoyed the ‘highs’ and the ‘comforts’ thereof, you should not be surprised when the time comes to pay the piper.

    So step forward and do exactly what? draw up a will…?

    Like

  41. David August 14, 2011 at 3:51 PM #

    @Bushie

    Gosh must you be so direct even if you are on point?

    Is it not passing strange that law abiding Barbadians have to visit a gun range to command the use of a gun but these scallywags seem to be able to do the same without ‘formal’ instruction?

    Who are teaching these hoodlums how to shoot with such precision?

    Like

  42. Observing August 14, 2011 at 4:19 PM #

    @Bush Tea
    I like the bluntness. Didn’t see Zoe’s post until you referenced it and haven’t dived into the moral/spiritual/metaphysical aspects of the problems under discussion on purpose. But to answer your question directly….,”who’s willing to step forward and publicly present, profess, preach, practice, propagate and perpetuate “THE ONLY SOLUTION.” I would love to be a part of such a movement but history, culture and casual observation tell me that I’m wishing on a star if I ever expect to see this on a consistent national scale in Barbados in my lifetime.

    Hence, this and other such discourses will continue until the time for this cycle to end comes.

    “Leadership requires real MEN.” Absolutely correct.

    Like

  43. Bush Tea August 14, 2011 at 5:33 PM #

    @ David
    Sorry about the bluntness, but the bushman is surprised that, all things considered, and given the range of discussions we have had here on BU, you can continue to believe that there is light at the end of the tunnel that is based on some kind of logical actions by human beings.

    IT WON’T HAPPEN DAVID.
    If anything, people are getting foolisher and madder.

    Time to look for a lifeboat David…. in fact, it is past time….

    @ Observing
    Independent of our likes, wishes, our ‘science’ ,and our theories – is the FACT that our whole life experience has been designed and created by spiritual beings, for a specific purpose and with irrefutable rules and laws. We can feel free to ignore these realities if we wish, but we CANNOT avoid the consequences.

    When an engineer designs a project, ordinary mortals may not understand all the technical intricacies, but they ignore the operating guidelines at their peril.
    …thus our present perils. The only viable solution requires our conformity to original design specs.

    EVERYTHING REAL IS SPIRITUAL MY FRIEND. It is our fragile temporary existence that is a fleeting aberration….soon to be ended.

    Like

  44. Sayed August 14, 2011 at 8:01 PM #

    @BT

    I have the same sentiments as you with regard to a lifeboat and logical human beings.

    But we still have the choice to roll over, or go down fighting. Many people throughout history have single handed-ly shaped it.

    There was Jesus to start with. There was King James, I know I’ll miss alot but this is who comes to mind…Napolean with the Napoleanic civic code, where he believed men were created equal and not based on class and social standing.

    There was Martin Luther King Jr. all those people didn’t give up in the face of adversity and they had far nastier things to fight against than us. Martin had racism to fight against, and won the support of Kennedy who he became friends with and together they pushed to eliminate segregation. Napolean fought against the English elites who for centuries ruled based on nobility.

    So whether we fail or not, let us adopt the win attitude even though like I said I admit, I’d like to set sail for Texas USA. Where a man has the right to arm himself and defend himself. The last true bastion of a free man.

    Like

  45. Zoe August 14, 2011 at 8:46 PM #

    What a man/woman sows, they WILL ultimately REAP!!!

    “Be not DECEIVED, God is NOT mocked; for WHATEVER a man SOWS, that will he also REAP. For he who SOWS to the FLESH* (SINFUL nature, be it Drug Dealer, Politician, Businessman, White, Black, ALL inclusive!) WILL of the flesh (SINFUL nature) REAP CORRUPTION* but he who SOWS to the Spirit ((The Gospel of Christ, IN* the Holy Spirit) will of the Spirit REAP* everlasting LIFE*” ( Gal. 6: 7,8 Emphasis added)

    Exegesis:

    “Whatsoever a man soweth” (ho ean speires anthropos). Indefinite relative clause with 9ean) and the active subjunctive (either aorist or present, form same here) “That” (touto). That very same THING, not something different. “Reap” (therisen). “Corruption” (phthoran). this PRECISE* meaning turns on the context, here plainly the PHYSICAL and MORAL* DECAY* or ROTTONNESS* that follows SINS* of the flesh as ALL men know .

    Nature writes in one’s body, as God designed it, the PENALTY of SIN* as every doctor knows. (Word Pictures in The New Testament, Vol IV, p.316 Emphasis added).

    Like

  46. Zoe August 14, 2011 at 9:10 PM #

    It is also imperative to stress and emphasize, that while we hear and SEE via media, the CRIMES committed by drug-related murders, etc, etc, God SEES the heart of every man/woman, be they Doctors, Lawyers, Executives, private-sector or public-sector or whoever, the PRIVATE SINS* actively committed across our society EVERY living moment, so that
    NO ONE can hide from HIM*

    It IS* this collective and RAMPANT SIN* in our society, that IS* bringing God’s Judgment UPON all nations, as our SIN* both individually and collectively IS* RIPE* for JUDGMENT!

    Like

  47. Vibe Worx August 14, 2011 at 10:30 PM #

    I read with some cynical amusement all of the comments above, which, while rooted in genuine concern for our country, also come across largely as talk in a vacuum, since no-one seem willing or able to analyze the law surrounding sentencing policy in Barbados.

    Magistrates and Judges cannot impose any sentence they wish…and I know enough judicial officers to know that they are equally unhappy with the limits imposed upon them by -wait for it- Parliament and the CCJ,

    Parliament, containing lawyers and non-lawyers, pass legislation that circumscribes the power of the judiciary when it comes to sentencing. Look no further than section 3 of the Magistrates Courts Act with regard to sentencing guidelines, for example. Except for extreme cases under the Drug Abuse (Prevention and Control) Act, the Copyright Act, and the Theft Act, no Magistrate can impose a sentence or sentences amounting to an excess of 5 years. Before a Magistrate or Judge can impose a prison sentence, the CCJ has bound them to seek pre-sentencing report from an overworked and understaffed Probation Office. Now, the latest restriction is that remand has to be factored in when calculating the overall duration of sentences.

    Factor in the simple fact that despite having over 500 lawyers in Barbados, only about 15 actually practice criminal law in a total of 8 High Courts, 10 Magistrates Courts, and one Court of Appeal. Try getting cases done where all of these lawyers have to be in several courts at once!!

    Is there cause for concern? Definitely. However, it is pointless to put forward comments criticizing sentences unless one does some reading of the legislation. My challenge to all of you good people: read the law, then contact your Parliamentarians and demand CHANGE.

    Like

  48. John August 15, 2011 at 4:53 AM #

    Sayed

    I’ll miss alot but this is who comes to mind…Napolean with the Napoleanic civic code, where he believed men were created equal and not based on class and social standing.

    Napolean fought against the English elites who for centuries ruled based on nobility.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    France freed its slaves in 1794 based on the underpinnings of the revolution, Liberty, Equality Fraternity.

    Enter Napoleon 1798 or thereabouts.

    First chance he gets during peace in 1801-1802 that he can risk a French fleet transporting an army (Nelson and the English had that effect) he sends LeClerc and 22,000 men to Haiti to reimpose slavery.

    Likewise Richepanse was sent to Guadeloupe with the same goal.

    Richepanse got it done with a loss of life of 10,000 plus.

    LeClerc was not successful, loss of life probably in the 100,000’s.

    I have seen a figure of 50,000 French soldiers dead in Haiti so reckon the other side lost even more.

    Napoleon sent reinforcements to Leclerc during peace until once again, Nelson and the English stepped in to blockade French ports once war recommenced.

    By the end of 1803 the French in Haiti starved of reinforcements sought terms of surrender. Haiti decalsred Independence on Jan 1 1804.

    The French kept slavery in their colonies until 1848, the English abolished the slave trade and slavery itself in theirs by 1834.

    My suggestion is that you remove Napoleon from your mind when you are considering such high minded things as equality!!

    Like

  49. John August 15, 2011 at 5:13 AM #

    The violent crime we see in our country has been there for years, just hushed up.

    If people at the top don’t follow laws and are corrupt, the people at the bottom will likewise do the same.

    Remember Mark Stokes from the 1960’s I think?

    People are guided by example.

    I have seen somewhere that a fish rots from its head.

    The situation in Barbados has been in the making for many many years.

    The Cattlewash Beach House Aggravated Burgalry case was initiated by a crime committed in December 2008.

    This home invasion was committed against a Canadian family and as far as I can tell was hushed up.

    Luckily, no one was physically injured.

    Police work tracked down two perpetrators.

    Unfortunately, deficiencies in the same work freed them.

    Meantime, home invasions have increased and are now resulting in murder.

    We really have lost our way and it is no sense looking to our leaders.

    It can only get worse if we do.

    Like

  50. David August 15, 2011 at 7:34 AM #

    A 43 year old dead after being stabbed in Oistins last night. That is five for August.

    Like

  51. Ping Pong August 15, 2011 at 10:56 AM #

    The Commissioner of Police has suggested that the business of “cash for gold” may be fueling some of the crime in Barbados. Who are the persons who run such businesses? I believe that a very large majority of persons buy jewelry to keep for personal adornment and NOT for investment purposes. It is in rare and dire circumstances that people sell (or pawn) their jewelry to get money to meet some expense. I am therefor suspicious of any business that is receiving regular quantities of gold jewelry in return for cash. I thus agree with the COP that such businesses may be associated with criminality. So what are the authorities doing about such businesses? Given the nature of BU and other such blogs can the people behind these “cash for gold” businesses be exposed here? I note that in Jamaica the Government had to shut down the scrap metal trade because of the criminal destruction of infrastructure to get metal. There have been such incidences here in Barbados as well.

    Like

  52. Colonel Buggy August 15, 2011 at 11:21 AM #

    @Sean .The biggest criminals in this country are the ones who sit in parliament. They have the vote of the people to introduce and amend laws to deter the criminal from “cooling out at Dodds”, but like most politicians, they look towards the next election, rather than towards the fears and concerns of the populace .

    Like

  53. David August 15, 2011 at 12:18 PM #

    @Ping Pong

    The AG is on record stating in his last address that he is bringing legislation to address scrap metal and cash for gold business.

    Like

  54. David August 15, 2011 at 12:38 PM #

    We have had 22 murders year to date in a country which averages 25 murders a year. The COP believes that although we have worrying trends in crime stats it has not reached crisis level. BU begs to disagree with the COP.

    This talk about crime being down is BS, we are talking about reported crime. Please tell David Ellis so!

    Like

  55. John August 15, 2011 at 12:47 PM #

    There are also missing persons.

    These probably do not go into the murder statistics.

    I am told this number stands at 35 persons over a period of years.

    Published on: 12/17/08.

    by PHILLIPPE AIMEY

    DOES anyone remember Thelia Snagg?

    This month marks 20 years since the then-seven-year-old girl vanished, leaving her parents Eulene and Fernando, police and the rest of Barbados baffled about her disappearance.

    It was December 6, 1988, when Thelia, a reportedly very active and intelligent pupil at Eagle Hall Primary School, went missing leaving no clues as to where she might be, dead or alive for certain, except in the minds and hearts of those who knew her.

    Like

  56. Destiny August 16, 2011 at 9:59 AM #

    RUSERIOUS I agree with your post totally .We ammend laws but still no AG. What more are the police to do when they do they duty apprend these criminals and then a judge can sit , hide behind archaic laws and give people slap on the wrist for sentences . How can a man as Barbadians say juck another with a garden fork right through his stomach and cause death instantly be out in less than four years ? How can another man cut off the penis and stab another to death and be out also in less than four years ? This is madness .However doing something that does not cause death you can get more time . Lets be serious here our judicial system stinks .Our ministers people

    Like

  57. Destiny August 16, 2011 at 10:20 AM #

    The minister chew out and make teachers look like little children ,They are now like dogs without a bark .Dont hit the children ,parents refuse to discipline their “lil men and women ” and all is supposed to be well .When you can get a man 30 years old with over 50 traffic convictions and still holding his drivers licence something wrong .Many recidivist are on our streets and that is ok . From the time I saw that cash for gold offer on the foreign channels i said if and when it reaches Barbados it will be alot of trouble and hell to pay .Every body have to do their part .Parents need to come out of denial and the NOT MY CHILD CRIES .

    Like

  58. Sayed August 16, 2011 at 11:27 AM #

    Oh hey guys, don’t take it from me but read the newspapers…apparently the guy who raped the woman in st. john was on bail…

    ah well who cares right

    Like

  59. barcitizn August 20, 2011 at 1:15 AM #

    Law practice in Barbados is like a game to some of these lawyers, these young and old knows the ropes too well. The “would be” chief justice doesnt have a clue about current practice in Barbados legal system ,he’s coming in at too old an age to adapt, they will rap him around their fingers and he would become a laughing stock in office. It is a grave mistake that the current prime minister and the chief justice would have much more in common than their alma matar- and short lived too! Lawers say something nah!

    Like

  60. barcitizn August 20, 2011 at 1:29 AM #

    Can the Commissioner of Police in Barbados articulate how his proposed license plate policy will effectly lower car related crime other than effectively causing more revenue to the treasury by way of liscencing manufacturers.and higher cost for such items.

    When a speeding car takes off, will i be able to determine whether its plate is authentic and made of vinyl, plastic, metal or sprayed numbers?. people find it rather difficult to determine counterfeit money-whereby the latest technology in colourography and material science is inputed. I guess Christ sinkler loves this idea (more tax-money,money.).

    Like

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